When I read No Country For Old Men., I agreed with his view, having left the safety off home and school and experienced the business world. By then I realized how lucky I was to have had such a safe childhood and that many lacked the advsntsges I had. His portrait of the other side of life boiled down the corporate psyche to a tee.
Greg, Thank you for sharing that there are novels that you couldn’t get through! I tried to read The Road but the beginning was too much and I soon returned it to the library. Good to know that McCarthy had a softening at the end. Speaking of books has your new book been released? I’m still trying to finish your 700 pages on the Byzantine Empire but I do enjoy your writing!
The Road led me to much more interesting books, like Harlan Ellisons Boy and his dog. Which became a favorite movie, with a very youthful Don Johnson...
Greg, your Sunday reads are always thought provoking pictures of Roads I’ve often wished to travel, however...
I love love love Station Eleven, my first novel during the pandemic which made it ever more apt, and the adaptation on Max. Writers are my gods through these ridiculous times, you very much included...keeping my head from spinning off its axis.
Jun 25, 2023·edited Jun 25, 2023Liked by Greg Olear
I've tried once or twice to read "The Road," and could never get more than a few pages in for some of the reasons you mentioned. Reading should NOT be exhausting! McCarthy seems to write in a dialect of English that I don't want to deal with -- too much work. I also tried "Child of God," and again, more apostrophes, but STILL no quotation marks for dialogue, and you know, it's RIGHT THERE above the apostrophe, just press the SHIFT key! What the hell? Pretentious laziness.
"Station Eleven" I read when you first mentioned it back at the end of 2021, but I still haven't watched the show. There are some books I want to see as movies and mini-series, and some I DO NOT, and "Station Eleven" is in the DO NOT category. HBO or not, I feel like all anyone could do is screw up that story, putting it on screen. There is supposed to be a "Dark Tower" mini-series coming from Mike Flanagan that I am also NOT looking forward to. EACH of those seven books could be its own mini-series, and unless the thing is seven seasons long, putting the lie to "mini," it will pale in comparison to the source material. Don't EVEN get me started on the 2017 movie! Ugh, whatever.
On several other hands, I WOULD like to see, "Success Stories of a Failure Analyst: The Life of Franklin St. John," made into a movie, but unfortunately, I'd want 1940s Jimmy Stewart to play the lead, and that's not in the cards. What a fantastic book. It is truly a fully American story and makes me believe that not EVERY millionaire and billionaire in the country came by their fortune through lying, cheating, and stealing. Kind, generous, caring, hard-working, and a man filled with common sense, "Frank" is an inspiring man. People like Trump and Musk aren't even worthy to CHECK if his shoes are tied! I think I just wrote most of my Amazon review! Thanks, Greg.
I'm with you on not wanting to watch adaptations of certain things, and STATION ELEVEN is atop that list. And YES, USE THE DAMN QUOTATION MARK FFS. I don't understand what these writers think they're doing. It's so pretench.
And thanks so much for the nice review, Steve, which I have seen on Amazon. Much appreciated, and I'm so glad you enjoyed the book!
Your final conclusion of the piece, “we novelists know we don’t know,” is the perfect point to make in the comparison between manifestos and novels. It struck me when I read it as the salient point in the contrast between fundamentalism in general, and White Christian Nationalism in particular, and those of us who are ‘woke’. Having been raised in Christian Fundamentalism, I can understand the appeal of the believing-you-know drug and the high it offers, and the glorious sense of freedom that comes from realizing how incomprehensible the Universe really is.
Some people seem to NEED to know it all and will even make up things to fill in the gaps in their "knowledge." I have always been most comfortable with the mysteries.
So many who think they “know,” have no f***ing clue. Was it Twain who said, faith is believing what you know ain’t true, or some such thing. And DeSantis thinks being “woke” is evil, while buying his bull Schitt is the cat’s meow
I think it's a made up problem, like the CRT insanity. Chris Rufo did that deliberately, so I read. Don't know where. If repubs are not driving the narratives, then everything is a Dem socialist plan.
Thanks, Earl. This, in particular: "I can understand the appeal of the believing-you-know drug and the high it offers, and the glorious sense of freedom that comes from realizing how incomprehensible the Universe really is." is beautifully put.
Thank you Greg. "Where men can't live, gods fare no better." That line has resonated in my mind.
I saw the movie, " The Road," ( in part because I 've always enjoyed the varied roles Viggo Mortensen has played) but could not get through the early chapters of the book. Something about reading the words, vs watching it unfold in a movie is different for me. But the child in the story & the ending, left me feeling somewhat hopeful. And my mantra, throughout my life, has always been that I live with hope; so stories that offer hope & kindness, rooted in love ( which often begets sacrifice) would be my "go to."
In these recent years, with all the negative, anti factual, anti truth we've seen out there in media & out of the mouths of supposed. "authoritative" figures, I've felt an aversion some days to reading negative messages, even if some are sadly rooted in truth.
Additionally during these last several years, " God's" name has been bandied about quite a bit; but out of some lips, or expressed through the written word, it's been a God I've not recognized from the New Testament. Not the God that speaks of love, even towards your enemy. Nor the God of being non- judgemental, because that's really God's place to judge & inherent in the admonishment, is the suggestion that as much as we judge others, we will be judged. (Though I put the caveat here that discernment of good vs evil in a person or situation, is not the same as judging them. To me it's more about establishing truth of good vs evil & a warning beacon for others. Much like a lighthouse that shows others the waves that might take a boat seeking safety, away from crashing into the rocks, against a dark, uncharted shoreline.) Nor is the God I've seen mentioned in post & various narratives, similar to the God of forgiveness, mentioned in Christ's words; because we're in a sense, being told that we will be forgiven as much as we forgive; and that in the end forgiveness, in itself, may free the "forgiver," as much as it frees the forgiven. In the stories like " The Road" & ones similar to it..In the post apocalyptic world, if there are God's mentioned, it is not THAT God, but a God who is relentlessly, unforgiving, judgemental & unloving. Punishing. A very exhausting example of a dysfunctional, abusive, very bad parent. Often a figment of the speaker's/ writer's "shadow" unconscious being, that carries the vestiges of an abusive childhood that's taking huge amounts of headspace in the unconscious.
It is that/ those types of gods I've seen mentioned most by many folks, to frighten, cement people's obedience & fear, by some pastors & folks from similar type teachings. Teachings that are usually filled with dark intent, manipulations & always subjugation for another's ( mankind's) manipulations & end game.
A kinder, more forgiving, loving God serves little purpose in those landscapes & does not fare any better than it's human "prophets." Sadly those other mockeries of God, are the ones we see bandied about most often lately, out of the mouths of angry, vengeful, men who would be gods if they could. Words, meant to frighten into obedience, but empty, hollow & leaden.
Imo, whether we are believers or not, in this world or another we might wish to subscribe to our better nature; to our better ideal/ idea of "our better God.) Loving, compassionate, forgiving, non judgemental. At least the best version of what we'd wish for in our best "parent, " the one we might have wished for in our hearts, in our childhoods. The one we might wish for in our heart to give our children. It's never too late & it could be game changing, not just for your children in their world, but for ourselves. Perhaps it is our best hope for having a better outcome for our futures & our world..........
On another tangent, just for a moment...imagine Donald Trump if he had had, a more moral, better, kinder, loving, more present father & mother. Alternate reality right, but oh the possibilities, not just for the country or world, but for his children.
Sorry Greg. Just meandering thoughts given yours today. Have a good week.
The Old Testament god IS like an abusive father. Some thinker, I forget who, wrote around the first or second century that the Old Testament god was really Satan in disguise. Hard to wrap your mind around it all. But then, our minds are not designed to wrap around it all.
Not sure Trump could have been saved, even if his parents were better. But maybe if they were poorer, he'd not have been empowered? I don't know. I wish there was a reality we could re-live and find out.
To me, the entirety of The Road was how humans create god in their image, and thus the world. McCarthy’s literary voice is the wilderness itself, sparse and unsparing. An enjoyable read? No, but intriguing still.
Good point, Layne. I agree, the prose is simple but intentionally confusing, to simulate their confusion about what year it is, what month, where they are, all of it. The imprecision is like weeds covering over everything. Or something. Like how Moby -Dick is long and dull at times to simulate the tedium of a long sea voyage.
Greg, the trump comment was me looking through rose colored glasses. On occasion, I put them on figuratively speaking & like to do a " what if" about things that likely would never occur. An exercise in imagination in a manner of speaking... ;)
That is such a great post. I’ve struggled to get through one of McCarthy’s books too—just couldn’t do it. I’ll be looking for the book you love now.
Thanks, Peggy. I can't recommend STATION ELEVEN highly enough.
When I read No Country For Old Men., I agreed with his view, having left the safety off home and school and experienced the business world. By then I realized how lucky I was to have had such a safe childhood and that many lacked the advsntsges I had. His portrait of the other side of life boiled down the corporate psyche to a tee.
The corporate psyche --> the corporate psychopath.
Greg, Thank you for sharing that there are novels that you couldn’t get through! I tried to read The Road but the beginning was too much and I soon returned it to the library. Good to know that McCarthy had a softening at the end. Speaking of books has your new book been released? I’m still trying to finish your 700 pages on the Byzantine Empire but I do enjoy your writing!
Thanks, Christine.
Oh, god, there are plenty I can't get through. On Sunday Pages, I like to keep it to stuff I like.
Byzantine historical fiction can be a slog, for sure. The nature of the beast...
The Road led me to much more interesting books, like Harlan Ellisons Boy and his dog. Which became a favorite movie, with a very youthful Don Johnson...
Greg, your Sunday reads are always thought provoking pictures of Roads I’ve often wished to travel, however...
Thanks, Patrick! I don't know that one. I'll keep my eye out for it.
Beautiful. Your post made me tear up.
Ditto.
Thanks! As I told Kris, this is a high compliment.
Thanks, Kris! That is a high compliment.
I love love love Station Eleven, my first novel during the pandemic which made it ever more apt, and the adaptation on Max. Writers are my gods through these ridiculous times, you very much included...keeping my head from spinning off its axis.
Thanks so much, Julie. I love love love it too. Have NOT seen the show, but I hear it is quite good, and worthy of the book's excellence.
Episode 1 is all you need, superb.
The reader that I am, I have never read any of those novels, but saw all three movies, not sure if I could stomach the books!
I didn't even see the movies!
I've tried once or twice to read "The Road," and could never get more than a few pages in for some of the reasons you mentioned. Reading should NOT be exhausting! McCarthy seems to write in a dialect of English that I don't want to deal with -- too much work. I also tried "Child of God," and again, more apostrophes, but STILL no quotation marks for dialogue, and you know, it's RIGHT THERE above the apostrophe, just press the SHIFT key! What the hell? Pretentious laziness.
"Station Eleven" I read when you first mentioned it back at the end of 2021, but I still haven't watched the show. There are some books I want to see as movies and mini-series, and some I DO NOT, and "Station Eleven" is in the DO NOT category. HBO or not, I feel like all anyone could do is screw up that story, putting it on screen. There is supposed to be a "Dark Tower" mini-series coming from Mike Flanagan that I am also NOT looking forward to. EACH of those seven books could be its own mini-series, and unless the thing is seven seasons long, putting the lie to "mini," it will pale in comparison to the source material. Don't EVEN get me started on the 2017 movie! Ugh, whatever.
On several other hands, I WOULD like to see, "Success Stories of a Failure Analyst: The Life of Franklin St. John," made into a movie, but unfortunately, I'd want 1940s Jimmy Stewart to play the lead, and that's not in the cards. What a fantastic book. It is truly a fully American story and makes me believe that not EVERY millionaire and billionaire in the country came by their fortune through lying, cheating, and stealing. Kind, generous, caring, hard-working, and a man filled with common sense, "Frank" is an inspiring man. People like Trump and Musk aren't even worthy to CHECK if his shoes are tied! I think I just wrote most of my Amazon review! Thanks, Greg.
I'm with you on not wanting to watch adaptations of certain things, and STATION ELEVEN is atop that list. And YES, USE THE DAMN QUOTATION MARK FFS. I don't understand what these writers think they're doing. It's so pretench.
And thanks so much for the nice review, Steve, which I have seen on Amazon. Much appreciated, and I'm so glad you enjoyed the book!
Your final conclusion of the piece, “we novelists know we don’t know,” is the perfect point to make in the comparison between manifestos and novels. It struck me when I read it as the salient point in the contrast between fundamentalism in general, and White Christian Nationalism in particular, and those of us who are ‘woke’. Having been raised in Christian Fundamentalism, I can understand the appeal of the believing-you-know drug and the high it offers, and the glorious sense of freedom that comes from realizing how incomprehensible the Universe really is.
Some people seem to NEED to know it all and will even make up things to fill in the gaps in their "knowledge." I have always been most comfortable with the mysteries.
Touché!
Milton:
"Sleep on,/ Blest pair: and O yet happiest if ye seek/ no happier state, and know to know no more."
So many who think they “know,” have no f***ing clue. Was it Twain who said, faith is believing what you know ain’t true, or some such thing. And DeSantis thinks being “woke” is evil, while buying his bull Schitt is the cat’s meow
Exactly, Jeri!
I stumbled upon some further insight into this "war on woke" business, but it's going to take me a while to be able to write about it properly...
I think it's a made up problem, like the CRT insanity. Chris Rufo did that deliberately, so I read. Don't know where. If repubs are not driving the narratives, then everything is a Dem socialist plan.
Thanks, Earl. This, in particular: "I can understand the appeal of the believing-you-know drug and the high it offers, and the glorious sense of freedom that comes from realizing how incomprehensible the Universe really is." is beautifully put.
Nice to be free to get back to Literary genre, eh, what? ☺️🙃🤫🫵🇺🇸
It WOULD be nice, Ed. : )
😁👊🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
I liken Cormac McCarthy to John Grisham. I would only read them if held over in an airport. But definitely want to see the movie.
Last nite I re-watched for the 4th time the movie The "Big Sleep."
I find it difficult to read "novels" since Raymond Chandler.
The problem with current fiction seems to be there's nothing "novel."
Just rearrangement of words.
Of course at 82 my favorite fiction is, "CITY" by Clifford Simak.
The publication with all Nine Tales.
And the dogs sat around the campfires and debated the possibility of humans.
Dogs have it figured out, and know who to suck up to
Jeri;
Human society is derived from watching wolf behavior.
A couple of non fiction reads by Dan Flores.
A Wild New World and American Coyote.
Coming soon: Novels by Robots.
Jenkins.
Guess that's why Freud was quoted as saying that man is wolf to man.
Didnt know that
Not surprised you're a Chandler guy. He's the greatest. I love him.
Thank you Greg. "Where men can't live, gods fare no better." That line has resonated in my mind.
I saw the movie, " The Road," ( in part because I 've always enjoyed the varied roles Viggo Mortensen has played) but could not get through the early chapters of the book. Something about reading the words, vs watching it unfold in a movie is different for me. But the child in the story & the ending, left me feeling somewhat hopeful. And my mantra, throughout my life, has always been that I live with hope; so stories that offer hope & kindness, rooted in love ( which often begets sacrifice) would be my "go to."
In these recent years, with all the negative, anti factual, anti truth we've seen out there in media & out of the mouths of supposed. "authoritative" figures, I've felt an aversion some days to reading negative messages, even if some are sadly rooted in truth.
Additionally during these last several years, " God's" name has been bandied about quite a bit; but out of some lips, or expressed through the written word, it's been a God I've not recognized from the New Testament. Not the God that speaks of love, even towards your enemy. Nor the God of being non- judgemental, because that's really God's place to judge & inherent in the admonishment, is the suggestion that as much as we judge others, we will be judged. (Though I put the caveat here that discernment of good vs evil in a person or situation, is not the same as judging them. To me it's more about establishing truth of good vs evil & a warning beacon for others. Much like a lighthouse that shows others the waves that might take a boat seeking safety, away from crashing into the rocks, against a dark, uncharted shoreline.) Nor is the God I've seen mentioned in post & various narratives, similar to the God of forgiveness, mentioned in Christ's words; because we're in a sense, being told that we will be forgiven as much as we forgive; and that in the end forgiveness, in itself, may free the "forgiver," as much as it frees the forgiven. In the stories like " The Road" & ones similar to it..In the post apocalyptic world, if there are God's mentioned, it is not THAT God, but a God who is relentlessly, unforgiving, judgemental & unloving. Punishing. A very exhausting example of a dysfunctional, abusive, very bad parent. Often a figment of the speaker's/ writer's "shadow" unconscious being, that carries the vestiges of an abusive childhood that's taking huge amounts of headspace in the unconscious.
It is that/ those types of gods I've seen mentioned most by many folks, to frighten, cement people's obedience & fear, by some pastors & folks from similar type teachings. Teachings that are usually filled with dark intent, manipulations & always subjugation for another's ( mankind's) manipulations & end game.
A kinder, more forgiving, loving God serves little purpose in those landscapes & does not fare any better than it's human "prophets." Sadly those other mockeries of God, are the ones we see bandied about most often lately, out of the mouths of angry, vengeful, men who would be gods if they could. Words, meant to frighten into obedience, but empty, hollow & leaden.
Imo, whether we are believers or not, in this world or another we might wish to subscribe to our better nature; to our better ideal/ idea of "our better God.) Loving, compassionate, forgiving, non judgemental. At least the best version of what we'd wish for in our best "parent, " the one we might have wished for in our hearts, in our childhoods. The one we might wish for in our heart to give our children. It's never too late & it could be game changing, not just for your children in their world, but for ourselves. Perhaps it is our best hope for having a better outcome for our futures & our world..........
On another tangent, just for a moment...imagine Donald Trump if he had had, a more moral, better, kinder, loving, more present father & mother. Alternate reality right, but oh the possibilities, not just for the country or world, but for his children.
Sorry Greg. Just meandering thoughts given yours today. Have a good week.
"The gods fare no better. "
Man invented gods.
" Man invented gods." God's invented man?...It wasnt a debate really on my part. Either case, we're not doing that well..either way, are we.
Thanks for this, Bonnie. Lots in here to ponder.
The Old Testament god IS like an abusive father. Some thinker, I forget who, wrote around the first or second century that the Old Testament god was really Satan in disguise. Hard to wrap your mind around it all. But then, our minds are not designed to wrap around it all.
Not sure Trump could have been saved, even if his parents were better. But maybe if they were poorer, he'd not have been empowered? I don't know. I wish there was a reality we could re-live and find out.
Man a failed experiment
To me, the entirety of The Road was how humans create god in their image, and thus the world. McCarthy’s literary voice is the wilderness itself, sparse and unsparing. An enjoyable read? No, but intriguing still.
Good point, Layne. I agree, the prose is simple but intentionally confusing, to simulate their confusion about what year it is, what month, where they are, all of it. The imprecision is like weeds covering over everything. Or something. Like how Moby -Dick is long and dull at times to simulate the tedium of a long sea voyage.
While we (though I'm an incompetent novelist) "know we don’t know" it doesn't stop us having opinions, lol.
Greg, the trump comment was me looking through rose colored glasses. On occasion, I put them on figuratively speaking & like to do a " what if" about things that likely would never occur. An exercise in imagination in a manner of speaking... ;)