Awesome. Thank you. I have been distressed with the published reports about the withdrawal from Afghanistan. You have laid out some of the history of that country to put it in context. It is complex, not at all simple, & the right decision. How many more of our service people should we sacrifice in order to bring democracy to Afghanistan? No one has offered a number. Very few of the politicians have offered family members to be sacrificed for this ideal. Not all the wounds suffered have been physical. I’m glad Biden made that tough decision that should have been made many years ago. On Twitter, Elizabeth Shackelford has a thread talking about the logistics in leaving as she was in Sudan when they evacuated. It is worth reading as an accompaniment to your article.
Great read. Some things I knew most I didn't know so, thanks for this writing.
Keep it going. Well done.
The press has had a field day beating up on Pres. Biden and his admin. But persons directly responsible for this 20 year debacle, were never touched to that extent. They were given the drive by admonishment.
CNN and MSNBC were, and still are being dishonest. They're going for the sizzle and not the steak. They're going for sensationalism and not facts and truth.
I am yet another woman offering my take. First, thank you for your brilliant accounts of history and bringing it forward to now. I see such parallels of man wanting full control over women in our country, albeit, not as extreme as the Taliban, but if allowed, it would set us back decades. I would like to point out that only one person in Congress opposed going after Afghanistan that was Barbara Lee who is our most honorable representative from California. A forward thinking wise woman. We should’ve listened to her. In fact, women possess powerful skills so much so, that man is fearful of them. I am nearing 70 so my perspective is a little different than yours. I marched against the Vietnam War in the late 60’s, early 70’s, burned my bra, wore tattered hip-hugger jeans, hitch-hiked, etc.
Psychologically, there is something very “off” with a man’s way of thinking. It’s animalistic. You know, “must fight to the finish” attitude.
Perhaps a longitudinal study should be administered.
This is excellent. I seldom ever watch CNN for reasons you describe above. However, I also had issues with the coverage by MSNBC. After several hawks were invited to spew their anti-Joe venom freely on that channel, I just turned it off.
Thank you, Greg, for saying that Biden is the best president of your lifetime. I have thought the same thing for the past few months, but have not uttered that anywhere. It's expected now that anyone on the Left is required to ALWAYS say that Obama is the best president of their lifetime, and for me, he has slipped to #2. He may have gotten us out of the worst economic downturn since 1929, and fought tooth and nail against the obstructionists in Congress and STILL got the ACA passed, but he didn't contend with a global pandemic at the same time as he was drawing down a war that had gone on for twenty years. Oh! And for good measure, also got an ACTUAL infrastructure package going through Congress. Joe also always speaks to people so that they understand where he's coming from, in their language. I enjoyed all of Obama's speeches, but thought several time that he really wasn't playing well in Peoria. To his credit, he spoke at a high school/college level, while most people only understand at a fifth or sixth grade level, or tune out. The first president I can remember is Nixon, so it's sort of a no-brainer to pick the best AND the worst in my lifetime. And let's also not forget that Obama did NOT get us out of Afghanistan.
I also agree on cable news seemingly pushing for Biden to fail. I don't watch CNN, but do watch MSNBC, and even there, it's pretty obvious. I realize that I AM watching opinion shows in the evening, but the attitude has become quite egregious in the past month, especially with the guests on these programs. I can't even IMAGINE what's going on at Fox News!
I've started on "The Afghanistan Papers," and am already disgusted by the tales in the book. The Troika of Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld in 2001, and the jingoistic cries of "USA! USA!" were perhaps the greatest factor in how we got to be in that sand-trap for 20 years. I admit that even I flew one of those stupid flags that attached to the top of a closed car window after 9/11. But then I heard that we were going to START a "War on Terror." Wait, a war on what? It was one of the dumbest things I'd ever heard. How can you have a war on an idea, and not expect to get into a quagmire you can NEVER get out of? It was dumb then, and it's still dumb. Instead of going in with the single-minded goal of taking out bin Laden and his gang, we were going to go after the whole idea of terrorism. Would anyone but a Republican think that that was a good idea, or even an idea at all? Once again, Democrats (save Obama) have to come in and clean up a Republican mess. And THIS was a HUGE mess for the ages. Biden IS the best president!
Obama made a lot of mistakes. Like, a lot. Like, way more than he should have. Some of them indefensible even in the moment. On the pod with Kurt, we talk about the weirdness of Nixon As Liberal, and how much good stuff he did before Watergate. As usual, history is confusing!
Excellent piece, Greg. I especially appreciate the fascinating historical overview.
And as for the Beltway Political Propatainment Complex, my wish for them, which I've communicated on Twitter, is that they are forced to realize how irrelevant and unimportant they are. Perhaps Stephen Miller will hire them to polish his jack boots.
Comprehensive, detailed, and right on. I am in awe of President Biden's courage in ending the war and standing up to the talking heads like Andrea Mitchell. This morning on NPR I heard sportscaster A Martinez mansplaining to an Afghan woman about how she should be feeling! I hope you'll dive into the opium cultivation that we also failed to stop after 20 years, and which funds the Taliban...who else? Meanwhile, here's a song from 2009 that is relevant: https://youtu.be/YMBAVNud9cQ
Thanks for your clear eyed and informed perspective. The last few weeks of major media coverage has been pathetic. I normally only watch PBS Newshour and bits of MSNBC on Youtube, but even PBS seems to have sold out to sensationalism (CNN lite). Maybe it's just me but I could swear their Kabul correspondent was delighting in the exploitation of the Afghan people's suffering. They have also made a real habit of putting liars on to get their "point of view". I'm done with PBS. My question now is, what can one watch for real news?
Djt lost 63 troops there, a de escalation from Bush & unfortunately, Prez O, but still…..WBush daughter on nbc talk show might be a conflict of interest for network (I worked at local nbc affiliate for 6 yrs ‘80’s-90’s) I had a visceral reaction to recent journalist male & female, but niceties prevent me from elaborating. Point is, these questions need to be posed to the media directly in a platform besides Twitter, maybe interview the nabobs of journalism. Epic Hollywood movie could be made on Lord Elfinstone. Pompeo is the ultimate Bagman he even posed for a picture.
Awesome. Thank you. I have been distressed with the published reports about the withdrawal from Afghanistan. You have laid out some of the history of that country to put it in context. It is complex, not at all simple, & the right decision. How many more of our service people should we sacrifice in order to bring democracy to Afghanistan? No one has offered a number. Very few of the politicians have offered family members to be sacrificed for this ideal. Not all the wounds suffered have been physical. I’m glad Biden made that tough decision that should have been made many years ago. On Twitter, Elizabeth Shackelford has a thread talking about the logistics in leaving as she was in Sudan when they evacuated. It is worth reading as an accompaniment to your article.
Thanks. And thanks for suggesting that excellent thread by Shackelford.
Great read. Some things I knew most I didn't know so, thanks for this writing.
Keep it going. Well done.
The press has had a field day beating up on Pres. Biden and his admin. But persons directly responsible for this 20 year debacle, were never touched to that extent. They were given the drive by admonishment.
CNN and MSNBC were, and still are being dishonest. They're going for the sizzle and not the steak. They're going for sensationalism and not facts and truth.
They miss their ratings golden goose, tfg.
Yr correct in a disgusting way
Thank you!
They are addicted to the clicks. And we are all paying the price.
I am yet another woman offering my take. First, thank you for your brilliant accounts of history and bringing it forward to now. I see such parallels of man wanting full control over women in our country, albeit, not as extreme as the Taliban, but if allowed, it would set us back decades. I would like to point out that only one person in Congress opposed going after Afghanistan that was Barbara Lee who is our most honorable representative from California. A forward thinking wise woman. We should’ve listened to her. In fact, women possess powerful skills so much so, that man is fearful of them. I am nearing 70 so my perspective is a little different than yours. I marched against the Vietnam War in the late 60’s, early 70’s, burned my bra, wore tattered hip-hugger jeans, hitch-hiked, etc.
Psychologically, there is something very “off” with a man’s way of thinking. It’s animalistic. You know, “must fight to the finish” attitude.
Perhaps a longitudinal study should be administered.
If what you're proposing is to let women run the country for a while, I could not endorse that enthusiastically enough.
Have you read HUMAN SMOKE by Nicholson Baker? Excellent pacifist look at WW2.
I have not but will make sure that I do. Thank you!
This is excellent. I seldom ever watch CNN for reasons you describe above. However, I also had issues with the coverage by MSNBC. After several hawks were invited to spew their anti-Joe venom freely on that channel, I just turned it off.
Thanks. Trump's guy is still in charge there. I doubt things will change until he's gone, and even then, who knows.
Thank you, Greg, for saying that Biden is the best president of your lifetime. I have thought the same thing for the past few months, but have not uttered that anywhere. It's expected now that anyone on the Left is required to ALWAYS say that Obama is the best president of their lifetime, and for me, he has slipped to #2. He may have gotten us out of the worst economic downturn since 1929, and fought tooth and nail against the obstructionists in Congress and STILL got the ACA passed, but he didn't contend with a global pandemic at the same time as he was drawing down a war that had gone on for twenty years. Oh! And for good measure, also got an ACTUAL infrastructure package going through Congress. Joe also always speaks to people so that they understand where he's coming from, in their language. I enjoyed all of Obama's speeches, but thought several time that he really wasn't playing well in Peoria. To his credit, he spoke at a high school/college level, while most people only understand at a fifth or sixth grade level, or tune out. The first president I can remember is Nixon, so it's sort of a no-brainer to pick the best AND the worst in my lifetime. And let's also not forget that Obama did NOT get us out of Afghanistan.
I also agree on cable news seemingly pushing for Biden to fail. I don't watch CNN, but do watch MSNBC, and even there, it's pretty obvious. I realize that I AM watching opinion shows in the evening, but the attitude has become quite egregious in the past month, especially with the guests on these programs. I can't even IMAGINE what's going on at Fox News!
I've started on "The Afghanistan Papers," and am already disgusted by the tales in the book. The Troika of Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld in 2001, and the jingoistic cries of "USA! USA!" were perhaps the greatest factor in how we got to be in that sand-trap for 20 years. I admit that even I flew one of those stupid flags that attached to the top of a closed car window after 9/11. But then I heard that we were going to START a "War on Terror." Wait, a war on what? It was one of the dumbest things I'd ever heard. How can you have a war on an idea, and not expect to get into a quagmire you can NEVER get out of? It was dumb then, and it's still dumb. Instead of going in with the single-minded goal of taking out bin Laden and his gang, we were going to go after the whole idea of terrorism. Would anyone but a Republican think that that was a good idea, or even an idea at all? Once again, Democrats (save Obama) have to come in and clean up a Republican mess. And THIS was a HUGE mess for the ages. Biden IS the best president!
Obama made a lot of mistakes. Like, a lot. Like, way more than he should have. Some of them indefensible even in the moment. On the pod with Kurt, we talk about the weirdness of Nixon As Liberal, and how much good stuff he did before Watergate. As usual, history is confusing!
Quite a good exposition of the Afghan Conflict thanks 4 elucidation
Thanks!
De nada
Excellent piece, Greg. I especially appreciate the fascinating historical overview.
And as for the Beltway Political Propatainment Complex, my wish for them, which I've communicated on Twitter, is that they are forced to realize how irrelevant and unimportant they are. Perhaps Stephen Miller will hire them to polish his jack boots.
Comprehensive, detailed, and right on. I am in awe of President Biden's courage in ending the war and standing up to the talking heads like Andrea Mitchell. This morning on NPR I heard sportscaster A Martinez mansplaining to an Afghan woman about how she should be feeling! I hope you'll dive into the opium cultivation that we also failed to stop after 20 years, and which funds the Taliban...who else? Meanwhile, here's a song from 2009 that is relevant: https://youtu.be/YMBAVNud9cQ
Thanks for your clear eyed and informed perspective. The last few weeks of major media coverage has been pathetic. I normally only watch PBS Newshour and bits of MSNBC on Youtube, but even PBS seems to have sold out to sensationalism (CNN lite). Maybe it's just me but I could swear their Kabul correspondent was delighting in the exploitation of the Afghan people's suffering. They have also made a real habit of putting liars on to get their "point of view". I'm done with PBS. My question now is, what can one watch for real news?
Thanks. Sorry I yelled at cnn and msbnc with my copy of this wonderful piece but I could not restrain myself.
Djt lost 63 troops there, a de escalation from Bush & unfortunately, Prez O, but still…..WBush daughter on nbc talk show might be a conflict of interest for network (I worked at local nbc affiliate for 6 yrs ‘80’s-90’s) I had a visceral reaction to recent journalist male & female, but niceties prevent me from elaborating. Point is, these questions need to be posed to the media directly in a platform besides Twitter, maybe interview the nabobs of journalism. Epic Hollywood movie could be made on Lord Elfinstone. Pompeo is the ultimate Bagman he even posed for a picture.